Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Incidents

Page for discussing incidents that may require action by administrators and experienced editors

Bastun needs to be topic banned from J. K. Rowling and from other BLPs that have commented on transgender topics. This is because of a persistent, ongoing issue involving WP:BLP violations because of Bastun's extremely negative feelings about Rowling, and their advocacy on the subject of transgender resulting in tendentious editing, which involves rejection of WP:NPOV, WP:IDIDNTHEARTHAT (IDHT) behavior, and personal attacks.

Note that on 4 July 2019, they were given a DS (discretionary sanctions) alert for BLP:

There is no shortage of helpful editors who seek to follow NPOV on these pages, adding positive and negative material. Bastun is acting as an obstacle and actively drives good editors away. I have therefore come here to seek a topic ban from BLPs that have commented on transgender topics. Crossroads -talk- 21:25, 29 July 2020 (UTC)

An example of Bastun reverting attempts to remove negatively-biased content is on the Graham Linehan page. The RFC that can be found on the Linehan Talk Page followed numerous attempts by other editors to change Bastun's biased section heading "Antitransgender activism", only to be immediately reverted by Bastun. Some of the times this occurred include (but are not limited to):
I thought that we had all reached the point where we would hash things out on the talk page instead of edit warring, but the page history suggests otherwise
I apologize if I implied that you were equally at fault. I thought that the timeline spoke for itself. I think it is fair to say that
[A] the first edit I put in the timeline was the first edit in the dispute (which in itself says nothing about whether it was good or bad, for or against consensus), Being first is simply a fact. It doesn't imply anything. There is no implication that the first edit in the dispute was in any way wrong. Many times it is the second edit where you start to see a problem. occasionally it is the seventh.
And some of those frequently INVOLVED in related discussions - notably ... Pyxis Solitary ....

The evidence-based discussion here has been largely confined to the (highly sensitive) J.K. Rowling article, but those seeking sanctions have suggested a much broader scope for a topic-ban. Is there evidence from any other page suggesting that problems extend beyond the single page? Newimpartial (talk) 10:48, 30 July 2020 (UTC)

Newimpartial should not be at this discussion. They were by El C: Newimpartial, you should not have responded to Lilipo25, anywhere, for any reason. Monopoly of pages or discussions do not usually accompany an WP:IBAN. If you address Lilipo again you risk imminent sanctions. There is unlikely to be another warning about that (should be taken as a final warning). Above you can see clearly they are effectively responding to/addressing Lilipo25. It is a case of . They obviously saw where Lilipo25 talked about the Graham Linehan page - there was no need to ask about evidence beyond the Rowling page. Newimpartial's I have seen some dubious accusations there is also a backhanded reference. Sure seems like a violation of El C's clear direction to me. Crossroads -talk- 18:19, 30 July 2020 (UTC) expanded Crossroads -talk- 18:29, 30 July 2020 (UTC)

mak[ing] reference to or comment[ing] on each other anywhere on Wikipedia...indirectlyOh Wow apologises I must be an ignorant self hating bigot. Thank you. Point scored.But for the point of this thread I am happy to bow down to your obvious greater knowledge in this matter. Gosh you are sooo right. You got me. Everything I have written must be wrong. I shall now disappear in a puff of trans terminology smoke.even amongst trans folks we do not all agree on terminology, as we are such a fragmented minority.means representing fairly, proportionately, and, as far as possible, without editorial bias, all the significant views that have been published by reliable sources on a topic.

Just to say that whoever Crossroads is talking about, who , that isn't a thing I do, and I don't think it is a thing Bastun does either (though I havent reviewed their entire edit history). Without diffs being provided, I wonder whether this is idle speculation on Crossroads's part or more some deep intuition. Newimpartial (talk) 16:52, 1 August 2020 (UTC)

present one or nearly-one POV ... as though it were the one and only trans POVAn editor must not perform more than three reverts on a single page—whether involving the same or different material—within a 24-hour period

a) Anyone commenting here needs to have read the Linehan RfC in full (yeah, sorry), and in particular , which addressed most of Lilipo's points from above, almost a month ago.

b) Yes, WP:BOOMERANG is a thing. I had been wondering about the merits of from the Rowling articles, as they seemed determined to remove or minimise anything that could be deemed negative, citing WP:NOTNEWS and WP:UNDUE, and to include or highlight anything that could be deemed positive, for quite some time. I hadn't gotten around to anything like recording diffs or quotes, but a scan of the talk pages Talk:J. K. Rowling and Talk:Politics of J. K. Rowling will show what I mean. E.g., I include coverage of two of the largest HP fansites, MuggleNet and The Leaky Cauldron, jointly announcing that they would no longer link to the Rowling's website, use photos of her, or write about achievements outside her HP fiction; this gets reverted as WP:NOTNEWS. Similarly, of The Trevor Project from the Politics of... article; removal of mention of a U.S. Senator prior to a vote (NOTNEWS, apparently, and a strawman about inferences); arguing against inclusion of mention of the , because NOTNEWS. Yet, at an RfC at the BLP noticeboard, the same user proposes including mention of support from Dana International (suddenly NOTNEWS doesn't apply?); and, at the Politcs article again, adds a new section on the fact that Rowling was one of 150 signatories of an open letter - while debate was ongoing. Again, NOTNEWS and UNDUE stopped applying?

So there's that, and that too needs to be considered by the community. I would point out the absolute irony of championing that particular open letter, on the one hand, and attempted cancel culture of someone whose views you don't agree with, on the other.

c) Crossroads mentioned quite a few editors. I'd be interested in hearing from some, too, involved in the Rowling and Linehan pages, who may or may not be aware of this particular AN/I, and may or may not wish to comment on my and/or Crossroads' editing: YuvalNehemia; Licks-rocks; -sche; Bodney; Ward20; Bilorv; Wikiditm; JzG. BastunĖġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ! 17:02, 30 July 2020 (UTC)

Trying to prevent POV pushing is not the same as actual POV pushing and advocacy.changed a section title. I now realise that this last action was counter to a Talk page discussion, for which I apologise.
Sorry; I have now corrected the name of the actual author of the diff, above.
The consensus is that the "Anti-transgender activity" section is fine in its current form

Comment I was pinged a couple of days ago, apologies for not replying sooner. In all honesty, I have avoided getting too involved in all this. However, I do strongly feel that there is a major issue at present with the editing of transgender related issues on Wikipedia, in particular with certain WP:BLP’s. The talk page atmosphere has become unhelpful and unconstructive, largely due to users’ insistence of casting aspersions on the motives of other editors. Unfortunately, this is something Bastun appears to do on a frequent basis. For what it is worth, I will add my experiences:

This should not be the way Wikipedia editors treat each other. Assume good faith should always come first, and seeing Bastun’s interaction with others as well, I do not feel that is how they are acting. Additionally, the Linehan RFC very clearly illustrates the problems in this area. I originally took part in it, but then had to step away from Wikipedia for several days for a variety of reasons. When I came back, the descent of the RFC made further involvement seem pointless. There is an utter refusal on the part of some editors to attempt consensus. There is a section title which multiple editors agree is contentious, which many are concerned violates standards for a WP:BLP and in particular of WP:LABEL and which is not widely supported by sources. Various alternate options have been put forward. A group of editors disagree that it is contentious and therefore refuse to discuss alternatives, and continually insist that the current section title remains. This should not be how Wikipedia works. If multiple editors feel there is an issue, the resolution is to find a compromise not to double down. It is pretty unacceptable that the section heading still remains. I am unsure as to whether a topic ban for Bastun would be the solution, he is not the only editor behaving in this manner. But something really needs to be done to resolve these issues. AutumnKing (talk) 15:26, 2 August 2020 (UTC)

Let me start for apologising for what will be a lengthy post - I feel it is necessarily so. I also want to stress that in writing it, I am accusing nobody of acting in bad faith, but I do think that there is some seriously problematic editing going on in this topic area.

I have been taken part in a number of discussions involving some of the editors mentioned and commenting in this thread. Some of them are noted above, but there have probably been others that don't jump so readily to mind. I've come to the conclusion that there are some issues that seem to make editing in this area particularly contentious, and make it difficult for some editors to truly follow the old WP:AGF maxim; discussions often become uncivil rapidly, quickly descending into sarcasm, personal commentary and accusations of improper conduct. There are numerous examples in the threads I've posted above, and many more can be found by checking the contributions histories of some of those commenting here.

I don't pretend to be in a position to comment on why some people find it so hard to collaborate constructively in this area with people who they disagree with. I think that Bodney's above about how they came to edit J. K. Rowling is interesting though. I don't intend to single Bodney out for criticism here, but if an editor is coming to a BLP because the subject has spoken out on an issue that is so close to the editor's heart, I think that it would inevitably be exceedingly difficult to avoid editing, unconsciously perhaps, with a RGW attitude, and it would perhaps be unusually difficult to see avoid seeing editors who are coming from a different viewpoint as being 'enemies', rather than collaborators.

I'm not sure that a topic ban for Bastun would do anything to solve the over-arching problems here; I wonder whether a more widespread approach is needed. BLPs are already covered by discretionary sanctions, which might need to be enforced more actively in this area, but I'm not sure whether that is in itself sufficient. is an example of Newimpartial telling an editor with whom they disagree that they are talking out of their arse. That sort of confrontational approach is not civil, it is a barrier to effective collaboration, but it is not on a BLP talk page. I'm starting to wonder whether 'Transgender issues' needs to be covered by its own discretionary sanctions, targeted at enforcing civility and cooperation. I'd welcome others' views on that. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Girth Summit (talkcontribs) 10:11, 31 July 2020 (UTC)

The I-BAN has has been ruled upon by an experienced admin. Wikipedia has legitimate avenues for appeals if that's what is desired. I would love some peace on that front. Lilipo25 (talk) 16:34, 31 July 2020 (UTC)

people making edits which a reasonable person might describe as "opposed to trans activists" insist that they have no agenda, but have no problem accusing people making edits that they see as "in support of trans activists" of POV-pushing.

(This section is for discussing what to do only. Any attempts to continue the battle here will be moved to another section per WP:TPOC)

The above clearly demonstrates that there is a huge battle going on regarding this topic. I would like to open a discussion about what to do about it. Suggestions? --Guy Macon (talk) 01:52, 2 August 2020 (UTC)

Suggestion: terminology RfC - it might help to have an RfC on NPOVN concerning whether "anti-transgender activism" is subject to normal sourcing requirements (like "anti-black violence" or "anti-Jewish sentiment"), or whether it is subject to the stricter requirements of LABEL. Lots of people think they know the answer to that question, but it gets discussed heatedly on various pages without any consistent outcome. Newimpartial (talk) 02:43, 2 August 2020 (UTC)

Query - I am wondering if there is any provision anywhere in the rules that could limit the sources that can be used for articles that are proven battlegrounds? I know it's a long shot, but it seems like a lot of the trouble occurs because there are so many subject-specific websites and publications now that whenever a topic is as controversial as this one, anyone can find a source that says pretty much anything on it that they happen to agree with. If we were limited to only using content from general news sources that don't specialize in either of the polarized viewpoints - meaning no feminist or LGBT publications - and that have a Wikipedia rating of "Reliable", it might cut out a chunk of the edit warring. I've never seen any provision for it and frankly, I don't even know if it's feasible, but figured I'd throw it out if we're brainstorming ideas here. Lilipo25 (talk) 05:33, 2 August 2020 (UTC)

If, as you claim, there are some who are innocent and some who are guilty, how do you explain the many comments opposing singling out a particular editor and blocking him?

I am reasonably certain that Wikipedia does not have a legal system, "civilized" or otherwise. Strong moral intuitions here, though. Newimpartial (talk) 18:03, 3 August 2020 (UTC)

The issues seem to be not adhereing to: "Be civil and follow dispute resolution procedures, rather than attacking editors or edit-warring with them. and not adhering to WP:AGF by mentioning motives of editors.

Propose: 1RR per editor per day, and trying to find an uninvolved admin to follow the article and give a week or more time out on the topic to any editor that violates WP:CIVIL, WP:AGF, WP:LAWYERING or WP:Tendentious editing. Ward20 (talk) 00:07, 3 August 2020 (UTC)

This is not a unique problem, there must be a history of how to handle this."Any attempts to continue the battle here will be moved to another section"

(As promised, moved from above section.) --Guy Macon (talk) 23:05, 2 August 2020 (UTC)

Comment: I already stated what I think needs to be done when I started this thread, and gave evidence when I did so: And very recent comment by Autumnking2012 is also particularly evidence based. The bulk of all this behavior occurred within 1 year of Bastun's 4 July 2019 BLP DS notification. There's been a lot of noise since this thread started consisting of WP:IDHT and whataboutism, but if administrators focus on the evidence, they will know what to do. Crossroads -talk- 16:00, 2 August 2020 (UTC)

Comment: I do think some problem editors need to be blocked or topic banned, and anti-trans POV-pushers pose a particular problem. Of course, over-eager non-transphobic editors can be a problem too, but a partisan with a strong, angry view about a vulnerable minority group will necessarily be a bigger problem when it comes to maintaining an atmosphere of WP:NEUTRALity and WP:CIVILITY. Everything the WP:NONAZIS essay says about racist POV-pushers applies just as well to transphobe POV pushers. Just substitute "transphobe" for "racist": The block a couple of years ago of for transphobia, a block which was upheld by community consensus, was a good start, but he was part of a larger circle of bad faith actors who contribute to a poisonous atmosphere on the site. WanderingWanda (talk) 20:32, 2 August 2020 (UTC)

[a] problem with racist beliefs is that they immediately alienate any non-racist. As soon as a good-faith editor begins to suspect another editor of harboring these beliefs, it becomes all but impossible for them to work together without conflict.Casting aspersions of [transphobic] trolling and vandalism should not, however, be used as a trump card in disputes over content or at a noticeboard. These claims can have a chilling effect and make the normal dispute resolution process difficult to go through....Unsubstantiated claims of [transphobic] vandalism and use of unsubstantiated claims to gain an upper hand in a content dispute or noticeboard thread is disruptive and a form of personal attack and will often lead to the user making it being blocked. Claims of [transphobia] should not be made lightly and editors should strive to work through the normal dispute resolution process when it comes to legitimate disagreements on interpretation and quality of sources and other content disputes rather than clear [transphobic] disruption.This section is for discussing what to do only. Any attempts to continue the battle here will be moved to another sectionPlease don't suggest topic banning Bastun as the solution to the battleground.

FWIW, I think that "anti-transgender activism" is obviously a WP:LABEL, since it's basically equivalent to "transphobic activism", but LABELs are sometimes justified. We call a whole bunch of neo-Nazis and white supremacists "neo-Nazi" or "white supremacist" when there's sufficient sourcing to justify it, and if anything is a LABEL it's "neo-Nazi". For example, the very first line of Richard Spencer is Richard Spencer is an American neo-Nazi..., without even in-text attribution. I feel like we need to update the wording of WP:LABEL to acknowledge more clearly that the presumption that these labels shouldn't be used can be defeated entirely (as in, even in-text attribution is not necessary) if the sourcing is strong enough. Loki (talk) 01:29, 3 August 2020 (UTC)

With all due respect, the comparison to Richard Spencer is not an apt one. I did not want to debate the WP:LABEL here, but as several editors have brought it up now with the argument that it is fine to call him "anti-transgender" in a Wikipedia heading because he is - and we now have a comparison of his views to those of Richard Spencer - I think it's necessary.

There are attempts to remove classification as pseudoscience from very reliable sources , , . There is a long-running conflict over socionics in the Russian Wikipedia. Almost all supporters of socionics were permanently blocked. --Q Valda (talk) 15:38, 30 July 2020 (UTC)

The above shows a clear pattern of deception on the part of ThesariusQ and their sock/meatpuppets. Ru-wiki has also had a major issue with sockpuppetry and other misbehavior in this area, leading to blocks of very many fringe theory proponents, as explained above. Such behavior is disruption and should be stopped. And ThesariusQ is still continuing to push WP:PROFRINGE views about socionics at Talk:Socionics and Wikipedia:Fringe theories/Noticeboard#Socionics. Crossroads -talk- 23:25, 5 August 2020 (UTC)

Let me preface this by saying I respect the time Ravenswing puts into the project.

That being said, there is a problem. Ravenswing has been prodding articles with longstanding problem tags. While I personally think that in general deletion of articles that have survived for over a decade is unlikely to be entirely uncontroversial, that's not even what this is about. The issue is that when anybody has the nerve to challenge a PROD or tag by Ravenswing, his response may be:

These examples are from this month, but apparently it ain't nothing new: "" is from December 2019.

I have asked Ravenswing directly in the discussion on Wikipedia talk:Proposed deletion#Ravenswing influx whether they acknowledge that this kind of approach isn't inspiring collaboration. Instead of answering the question, Ravenswing suggested I bring this to ANI.

In an ideal world, an admin tells Ravenswing not to be hostile towards his fellow editors, and Ravenswing agrees. In a less ideal world, Ravenswing would be topic banned from responding to de-prods and tag removals. — Alexis Jazz (talk or ping me) 09:45, 31 July 2020 (UTC)

In addition to the interaction on my talk page (I beleive this was prompted by my Preview (computing) deprod) that Alexis Jazz has already cited, I found this AfD discussion unnecessarily hostile. ~Kvng (talk) 14:33, 31 July 2020 (UTC)

This user is currently experiencing significant stress that may affect his ability to work on Wikipedia....work in quieter areas and avoid complicated tasks or areas prone to conflict.

basing on the experience I acquired about sources, writing a gay porn bio myself, I decided to get rid of all the not notable gay porn bio (there are so many, believe me). So, I started reading them, checking out the sources and when I found one that wasn't notable I put an advice on my page AlejandroLeloirRey, I left a message on the article's discussion page to ask if people had more sources and I looked for more sources myself. if after one or two weeks I couldn't find any significant source I nominated the article.

everything was fine until @Gleeanon409:: entered into a discussion, since then he kept following me around accusing me to nominate with out doing WP:BEFORE. I asked him to check my statistics to see that my nomination are pretty reasonable but most of all I asked him, politely, 1000 times, to argue the sources and not me. obviously he kept accusing me in any discussion (more than once per discussion). the first time he accused me I also left a message in his talk page to ask him if he wanted to help me out to find better sources for articles before I nominated them but he never answered. I asked for help on the teahouse but no one could help me.

I can't simply stand his personal attacks no more, so I have insulted him. for this reason I will be banned from wikipedia. obviously, for our community telling a person he is an A.H. or to F.O. is way worst that stalking a person for weeks pulling his never to the point he is ok with being kicked out as long as he gets rid of its stalker. --AlejandroLeloirRey (talk) 22:07, 1 August 2020 (UTC)

I just saw that an admin here said he (Gleeanon409) should have been blocked for edit war: --AlejandroLeloirRey (talk) 22:56, 1 August 2020 (UTC)

and this is the last one (notice that in this last one i offended him and swear at him and because of this I had a warning so I deleted my messages). As u can see Gene93k told him to discuss the article and not me also:

I encountered the op through watchlisting the LGBTQ article alerts, specifically their string of AfD’s targeting gay male porn actors. As I’ve previously stated elsewhere I have no issue with removing the ones that no longer arise to Wikipedia standards, bravo for eliminating crap articles. But their goal seems to be to systematically remove them all or at least as many as possible. (See their talk page for evidence of this.)

Where I sharply disagree, is with the OP’s tactics where they apparently don’t follow WP:Before—specifically searching for and identifying sourcing—and treating AfD as clean-up. Also their being combative towards those they disagree including being rude and dismissive, and repeatedly violating WP:AGF all while arguing and repeatedly filling the discussion with WP:TL/DR walls of text frustrating the entire process. Additionally they exhibit a breathtaking inability to use logic in their targets: (RS), a principal of RS and Hall of Fame winner, another , another Hall of Fame/Wall of Fame winner, another Hall of Fame winner. Much of this seems to be an odd vendetta against Wikipedia for trying to delete Carlo Masi.

pinging: @Kbabej:, @Ipsign:, @Chris7179:, @Toughpigs:, @Bearian:, @GoldenAgeFan1:, @Britishfinance:, @Cardiffbear88:, @Sharouser:, @QueerEcofeminist:, @Theroadislong:, @Kleuske:, @Sulfurboy:. Please feel free to comment.

I found of particular interest. Gleeanon409 (talk) 01:09, 2 August 2020 (UTC)

Gleeanon409's "stalking", as shown in Levivich's list of diffs above, is just commenting on three of Alejandro's AfD discussions, and chiding him for not following WP:BEFORE. Two of those AfD discussions (Rod Barry and Raging Stallion Studios) were closed as keep; the second one was even withdrawn by Alejandro. The third one (Tim Kincaid) also seems headed for Keep. It is possible to get a decent hit rate on AfD nominations and still make some mistakes. Saying that Alejandro should do a BEFORE is not a personal attack.

I believe that Alejandro is a bit zealous in wanting to delete as many gay porn bios as possible. He argues a lot with people voting Keep, and often refuses to accept other people's opinions on sources. (See WP:BLUDGEON.) I think that the process would be smoother, and get more positive results, if Alejandro would simply make his case for deletion in the nomination, and then allow the discussion to proceed without trying to dispute every Keep vote. If Alejandro could do that, and Gleeanon could participate in the discussion without making sarcastic comments about BEFORE, then the world would be peaceful once more. — Toughpigs (talk) 02:45, 2 August 2020 (UTC)

This is interesting, here you are displaying advanced mathematical equations and Carlo Masi—the article that seems to be the heart of all this—is a mathematician. Gleeanon409 (talk) 03:56, 3 August 2020 (UTC)

ok, I don't know how this works but, should I ping people who can talk positively for me or just let the facts and the examples here above talk for me?. is this a voting process? Once again, "77.4% match rate over 40 noms since April" proves I am not making disruptive AFD nominations (why are we even still talking about it?). Could I have done a better job sometimes? of course, like anybody else but this doesn't mean I didn't do WP:BEFORE. do I argue too much with people (text walls)? yes, just like Gleeanon409 does. But at the end of the day we are not here to decide if I am perfect because I am not, we are here to let know Gleeanon409 that he should argue the article nominated not the nominator and stop accusing me of something I obviously don't do, just to pull my nerve and provoke a reaction from me to make me kick out of wikipedia. --AlejandroLeloirRey (talk) 08:50, 2 August 2020 (UTC)

@Toughpigs: told me I am WP:BLUDGEONing this "discussion" (is this even a discussion? I thought an admin would have looked at the examples I gave, listened Gleanon and took a decision) so I am not going to answer anymore to the army that Gleanon called to defend him here. even though, after the army call I become the subject of the discussion so it is hard not to speak. let me just ask the adimin to look at my stats to decide if I was making disruptive AFD nominations and than to look how many times I had to defend myself from this accusation by Gleanon. thank you.--AlejandroLeloirRey (talk) 18:23, 2 August 2020 (UTC)

User is continuing to re-insert personal attacks at WP:RSL#Lessons learnt after they were reverted by me. Another editor reverted my removal and advised me to simply redact the offending portion, which I did, but 7&6 once again undid my redaction to reinsert the personal attack. In this case, the attack was the casting of aspersions on "the usual suspects" who showed up to "stealth delete" an article. This was an assumption of bad faith on all the participants of the various AFDs (three in total I think; the actual situation was a bit complicated).

This further goes against the general principle of focusing on content (or even process) rather than contributors. And it's not in line with the ostensible purpose of the project page it was posted on, which is for improving articles at AFD to the point where they can be kept, not for kvetching about an outcome you missed and didn't like.

I'm requesting that the attack (and yes, it's an attack) be removed, and for this to be kept in mind in case there are any similar problems in the future. –Deacon Vorbis (carbon • videos) 17:54, 2 August 2020 (UTC)

Simple statement of facts with appropriate links. This should not be a secret, and should not be kept that way. That they were able to accomplish this is a defect in the deletion process. No one is mentioned by name.
Unlike User:Deacon Vorbis who has been blocked three times for them, and know what he is talking about.
IMO the "worst" part is that you make your uncivil comments, which are sometimes outright personal attacks, in separate edits, and you just keep on compounding them. These are nine of your most-recent fifteen edits:

OK, let's just talk about one behavior: accusing noms/delete !voters of, e.g., not understanding policy, failing to perform a WP:BEFORE search, etc.:

These are just some examples, and I'll note they have much in common. What's my point? My point is this ANI report has merit. Levivich[dubiousdiscuss] 01:35, 3 August 2020 (UTC)

and from what I see you spend all of your time doing this ^ and casting aspersions against the ARS.
I participate in a lot of AfDs, and only vote when I think an article should be kept, so I'm sympathetic with the goals of ARS, although I'm not part of that group myself. That being said, the quotes listed above are pretty shocking. There really isn't a good reason to talk that way in an AfD — it's nasty, it promotes an unhealthy environment, and most importantly, it doesn't actually make you any more successful at achieving your goal.

Given the overall WP:BATTLEGROUND-mentality of the original comments that prompted this thread, as well as the subsequent ones listed by Serial and Levivich, along with the general WP:IDHT response to a behavioral complaint with not only a refusal to admit that something might be wrong, but also making more of the same kinds of comment, I propose:

7&6=thirteen is banned from commenting on anyone's behavior (explicitly or implicitly, broadly construed, including, but not limited to, speculating on motives) in any discussion or edit summary involving article deletion. They may still contribute to deletion discussions, WP:ARS, etc., as long as comments are focused on articles, sourcing, and so on.

Indeed, that they are characterizing some of my defenses at this very proceeding as 'misconduct' shows the paucity of their argument and their desperation. There ought to be an evidentiary privilege against use of such arguments.
The proposers of this are simply carrying on AFD discussions (which they generally lost) in a new and different forum. That they did not like those results is no reason to let them rule here. And they have been hostile to me for years. I could cite to these, but Ad hominem arguments are irrelevant on both side of this proposal.

They don't like the comments because they were true and effective.
This is all about sour grapes by persons who were on the losing side in these discussions. 7&6=thirteen () 12:14, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

Comment every once in a while I came to an AfD. I improve the article, and then the AfD nominator eviscerates the article to favor deletion. I did quite a bit of work to the article, and the work of editors should stand until this AfD completes. If anyone disagrees lets discuss on the talk page. Lightburst
Can either of you point to a single thing you added to the article that does not fit the above description? I note Thirteen is continuing their belligerent attempts to introduce clearly unreliable or irrelevant "sources" whilst they still have not responded to any of my very clear attempts to discuss their & Lightburst's unreliable and irrelevant contributions, both during the AfD and afterwards .

And now Lightburst is continuing the BATTLEGROUND behaviour after again being called out above, I await the arrival of Thirteen's !vote. Neither have given any response in the preceding TP section about their "sources". Cavalryman (talk) 23:50, 5 August 2020 (UTC).

These were keep votes because the articles should be kept. And the unwillingness of editors to do their homework before trotting out an AFD is problematical. Additionally, most if not all of those articles I helped build and source; and if the sources were available to me, and resulted in keep, the ends and means are coextensive. We were building a better encyclopedia. And as debates go on, it becomes apparent that they are a WP:Snow candidate, which I might note. Indeed, the AFD nominators withdrew several of the articles complained about above.
As to the perception that this is a battleground mentality, I only used the word "losers" to make plain the conflict of those who appear here, and acted in an outwardly hostile and unbending manner at the AFDs. Indeed, there are those editors who boast on their talk page about the number of article the helped delete.
The primary goal at WP:ARS for me was and is always article improvement. If I didn't think that the article should be a keep: I would have said so, or I would not have participated in the discussion.
That you can blink away an Admin telling an editor that he is an "ARShole", with the support of others, says a lot. We are all volunteers here.
The confluence between my votes and the outcomes is because the articles deserved to be kept, and should not have been nominated in the first instance. I choose my articles to improve carefully. I have been told that I had an 87% rate where I was with the majority and the outcome. I do not personally know if that was (or is) true, as I do not scoreboard.
Finally, I have managed to take many articles from AFD to DYK and appearances on the main page.

User:Deacon Vorbis made 4 refactoring edits regarding the comment on the ARS page: (here are the four: , , , ). Then DV reverted their fourth edit . DV was warned about their edit warring and then came to ANI, to complain about this comment that does not rise to this level. We have now all spent valuable editing time about this nothingburger. Lightburst (talk) 21:58, 2 August 2020 (UTC)

ARS seems to be a reasonably fertile breeding ground for battleground behaviour, and a current nexus for the perennial inclusionist / deletionist wars. I think ARS could materially improve their image if they were to refine the process for selection of articles. Am I alone in that view? Specifically, if there was some kind of gate that excludes articles with promotional and likely paid contributions, prioritises under-represented subjects (in the style of Women In Red), and includes a rationale for rescue, which some of the better nominations do (e.g. Roger Treat: "American sportswriter, mainly in newspapers. Wrote a monumental history of American football and was an advocate for racial integration in sports").

I'm concerned that right now anyone who has a pet article that's at AfD can just list it, and have a reasonable hope of attracting a group of editors who will only vote one way. A refinement to the selection criteria would make this less like an end-run around WP:CANVASS, which is how ARS is often perceived right now.

The constant lameness obscures the fact that parties on both sides of these perennial disputes are sincere and committed Wikipedians who are trying to improve the project. I see little evidence that the partisans are spending much time trying to understand each other's perspectives, which is a shame. Guy (help!) 09:52, 3 August 2020 (UTC)

You are quick to stereotype ARS members. If criticism is warranted, you need facts. And if such generalizations are to be indulged, you ought to consider looking at both sides. WP:AGF is sometimes suspended or unevenly applied. Just look at the above discussions.

User reported - (Diff of ANI notice)
Reported by - NewsAndEventsGuy
Sanction sought - Community-imposed site ban
Basis - WP:CIR
Summary - RTG's contribs demonstrate disruptive editing by refusing to answer simple questions, gaming consensus through stonewalling and gaslighting, and making personal attacks, etc. In RTG's own words (July 2020) . Like the tide, these things seem to roll in until RTG's energy is spent and the drama drains back to sea... until next time. The project has gained little from our forbearance, but has spent a fair bit of energy dealing with RTG's disruption and their contributions' lack of competence in collaborative editing and WP:CONSENSUS process. Since WIkipedia is neither a WP:FORUM nor WP:THERAPY, it is time for the community-at-large to ask RTG to pursue other interests. Ordinarily I'd suggest a temporary site-ban, but in this case RTG already made a RAGE QUIT followed by a 4-year quasi retirement. Immediately upon return RTG resumed an almost monthly disruption, so it is time to just part company. If you have trouble reading RTG's talk page due to the floating image, modify your common.css file with the code in the final collapsed story below.

"I feel like I've had a fresh argument somewhere on the site every week and contributed little in material terms..."

Apologies, for the large byte count in this report. These long-running low-intensity CIR-disruptions are hard to demonstrate with convincing brevity.

So take your pick. These stories show an editor who consistently applies IDNHT tendentiousness in disputes, and is generally unable to work together in a collaborative consensus endeavor. We should ask RTG to do something else with their time so we can be more productive with ours. It's time for a community-imposed indef ban.

(A) I'm not just selfishly interested here, but community interested. As RTG wears out the welcome in one place he takes the show on the road and buggers others. No one else should have to deal with this.
On Wikipedia, the term also carries the connotation of repetitive attempts to insert or delete content or behavior that tends to frustrate proper editorial processes and discussions.

THe above wall of self justifying wall of text leans me towards a site ban.Slatersteven (talk) 08:32, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

@RTG: Let me put this a little more bluntly: casting unfounded aspersions against other editors and needlessly replying to every person that comments on this thread isn't helping your case at all and is actually serving as a clear example of the tendentious behavior that prompted this thread in the first place. Ultimately, you're going to have to convince the rest of the editing community that you won't continue to be a disruption to the project. That being said, I still stand by the advice that I gave to you in April, which was OhKayeSierra (talk) 22:13, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

Either you've evaluated it and decided it must be lies, or you believe that my only response in a situation like this should be to grovel as I am obviously not a person that should have access to this site.I strongly urge you to reconsider your approach to editing if you wish to edit constructively on this project, especially when there have been numerous other editors that have already asked you to as well.There is a presumption that people who contribute to the English-language Wikipedia have the following competencies.... the ability to communicate with other editors and abide by consensus....

User reported -
Sanction sought - Community-imposed site ban
Basis - WP:CIR

I've noticed this user who has recieved dozens of warnings and a block for engaging in an edit war on numerous pages has been making a string of small vandalisms and intentional overt POV edits. The ones I've detected I've gone through and reverted but I can't keep a watch on all his future edits. What action can you recommend to avoid these future disruptions? He's just deleted his talk page so all prior warnings and blocks have been erased too. You can see some of them below. Many of his edits use the wording "Remove whitewashing". This user seems to be single issue. The list below is but a snapshot. He also told me to stop harrasing him for calling him out on this behaviour

Every user has times when they have different interpretations of wikipedia policy than other users. Some also have differing opinions of what constitutes NPOV vs POV. I personally find whitewashing of controversial or harmful acts and statements as POV pushing. Users are free to disagree, but that doesn't make my edits by default "vandalism". Also note that only a small proportion of my edits have ever been flagged or reverted for these issues. This user has been reverting my good faith edits and is presenting an extremely biased and misleading case against me, hence my accusations of harassment. Shadybabs (talk) 13:48, 3 August 2020 (UTC)

I would like to state that Shadybabs and I have no prior history. Unfortunately I stumbled across what I see as a high number of unhelpful edits or edits likely to be perceived as vandalism. Your deletion of your user talk page which involved a high number of previously disruptive incidents and a BLOCK, led to my suspicion that our interaction was not a singularity. I do not feel that I am reverting good faith edits when the user's main purpose APPEARS to be to change the political bias of every contentious article they come across. Alexandre8 (talk) 13:53, 3 August 2020 (UTC)

I'd appreciate help or advice on an issue at China–United States trade war . The main problem is that a few times now, has disappeared from the article and the talk page discussion for 1–4 weeks, and then has come back and reverted most or all of the updates and corrections that have been made in the meantime . I've asked the user to discuss these reverts on the talk page, but they refuse. On the talk page you'll find discussion of several other disputes, but when I asked the user to discuss these reverts, they said "I have my reasons for reverting your content, but the explanation will have to wait until after we have addressed and resolved your second round of mass purges of edits", "You'll just have to wait for me to tell you why", and "You'll have to wait for my explanation". I , and Flaughtin still hasn't provided one. This seems to be a case of WP:Status quo stonewalling.

It's impossible to keep developing this article when all the additions and corrections will just get reverted in a couple of weeks by an editor who refuses to discuss the reasons for the reverts. I'm not sure whether ANI is the best venue for this issue, but I'd appreciate help or guidance on how to deal with this situation. —Granger (talk · contribs) 19:12, 3 August 2020 (UTC)

The admins should shut this request down with prejudice. I can't be refusing to provide explanation for my edits when I have already said I would provide an explanation for them - it's just they will have to wait given the preceeding and proceeding mass purges/battleground edits the other user has made. It really isn't my problem that he/she wants to (or feels entitled to) jump the line and it really isn't my problem either that he/she doesn't read either carefully or at all - that isn't meant to be an insult, it is just meant to be a statement of fact as the debates on the talk page demonstrates. The rounds of debates has to be resolved sequentially, partly because of, again, the problematic edits the other user has made (the mass purges as I have already pointed out), partly for reasons of clarity (there are too many points of contentions to be resolved), and partly for reasons of fairness (this is self explanatory); to do it any other way would make it impossible to keep track of the sheer number of disputes which have to be resolved. The issue of my editing pattern is something that I have ; that said, I will going forward do my best to be more punctual in my response given the escalation of this matter, but again i cannot make guarantees on this because my life just doesn't revolve around Wikipedia.
Elmidae: As I have made clear in my comments above and many times to the other editor elsewhere I am prepared to explain my reverts - the real problem is that editor's sense of entitlement; specifically, the arrogance on his/her part to not just demand that I respond on his/her terms while he/she mass reverts my edits, but to be completely ignorant of the hypocrisy of the demand. He/she demands my immediate and unceasing attention to my reversion of his/her edits; meanwhile I'm supposed to just pretend that his/her never happened. I can understand if an animal accepted those kind of demands, but what kind of self-respecting person would do that? As I've said, going forward, I will do my best to be more punctual in my response given the escalation of this matter, but again i cannot make guarantees on this because my life just doesn't revolve around Wikipedia.
if you revert, you need to be prepared to explain your reasons. If you don't have the time to do that, don't revert.
User:Czello Taking the disputes to the talk page is what I have been doing all along. As for the time issue, as I've said (4 times now), going forward, I will do my best to be more punctual in my response given the escalation of this matter, but again i cannot make guarantees on this because my life just doesn't revolve around Wikipedia. This is the most reasonable response that I can give and I really don't know how many more times I need to say this.
Flaughtin is discussing some other disputes on the talk page, which is good. It would be better if they could be more civil and stop accusing me of not reading their comments. Now they're also trying to a 3O request that I opened about these earlier disputes.
I will address my revert of your edits until after we have addressed and resolved your second round of mass purges of my edits that you did here. We are going to (as a matter of chronological fact) do this sequentially and I will not let you jump the line just because you feel you are entitled to do so. As I am the author of the second round of edits which you purged, the responsibility per BRD falls on me to initiate the second round of debate, which I will start at the conclusion of this first round of debate (this includes the resolution of the corresponding 3O request for the first round of debate).
I think that's a workable idea. I'm not exactly happy with the current version, but I think the major problems with it are limited enough that they can be resolved through discussion fairly efficiently.
[stricken as I misunderstood the suggestion]
I would suggest that in general Flaughtin should respond within 24 hours. (This is the standard I usually hold myself to, in discussions where someone is waiting for my response.) And now and then, if Flaughtin is unusually busy once in a while, I don't mind for them to say so on the talk page and then take an extra day or two. What I find difficult to deal with is getting no response for days and days and then seeing all the edits made in the meantime get reverted.

@Mx. Granger: I was thinking of the latter, as I understood that was the main issue (reverting but saying "I have good reasons but no time to explain them, will happen in the indeterminate future"). Regarding responding to fresh comments, I think one can't hold people to firm timelines there; if life keeps you away from WP, then that's it. I don't believe you could reasonably hold someone to a once-per-day log-in requirement. The usual way this is handled, e.g. here at AN/I, is that if there is an outstanding issue that requires response, an editor is expected to deal with it when and if they do log into WP. Meaning that if they log in and then spend all their time on other wikitasks while ignoring the request for comment (but still expect others to wait on them), that constitutes active stonewalling and is disruptive. --Elmidae (talk · contribs) 19:26, 6 August 2020 (UTC)

Thanks, that's fair enough. I suppose if there's another long absence with unresolved discussions I'll seek input on what to do.

Following one month after the close (Dennis Brown: ) we have this deletion review. Evidently they have not gotten the point. I suggest that some kind of topic ban would be appropriate. --JBL (talk) 21:33, 3 August 2020 (UTC)

I'm going to assume Geo Swan gets the point, and just close this. No need to summarize what should be obvious.

Some very enthusiastic editors have crossed the line into personal attacks against Snowfire I've warned them, but somebody might want to have a patient word with FTIIIOhfive (talk · contribs) and LaneyJfromHoward (talk · contribs) about consensus and user conduct to de-escalate the tone. Acroterion (talk) 03:23, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

The user we had a dispute with spent days unilaterally placing language in article despite administrative attempts to get him not to. It became a problem and we responded. We are ready to quash the beef with the agreed upon language. Enough beef. Can you help facilitate the reversion? Bevkingcares (talk) 03:29, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

Hey guys, we quashing this? People wanna get some sleep. We agreed to the language and we apologize, snowfire. — Preceding unsigned comment added by LaneyJfromHoward (talkcontribs) 04:18, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

We may need more than partial blocks/page bans. Things really got out of hand at that talk page today. I did some hatting, and I gave a to the worst of the group, User:WillieHowardCO67, for personal attacks and harassment . After my warning they apologized and (sort of) tried to reconcile with the object of their attack, but the guns are still clearly cocked and loaded. This attack came AFTER my warning and their apology. -- MelanieN (talk) 05:06, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

We get it. We messed up. Sorry. It just wasn’t ethically right what we saw but I responded poorly and I apologize. Not trying to bully. I just let my emotions get best of me.WillieHowardCO67 (talk) 05:10, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

Update: FTIIIOhfive, LaneyJfromHoward, and WillieHowardCO67 have been blocked as sockpuppets of AlexVegaEsquire. Sockpuppet investigation here. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 06:23, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello, just so everyone reading this knows we are edit a thon participants and activists, not puppets of whoever. But we do support the changes to the Kevin Deutsch lead. And we are allowed to have our voices heard as people about other issues as well. I come in peace to resolve this.Highflyingkitty (talk) 14:39, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

You are wrong, we are not done, and you cannot call me names! This is why we are fighting white privilege on this website, being called an asshole by a guy named Jorn. Don’t you dare talk to me like that. Highflyingkitty (talk) 15:50, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

Wait so what do we do to make our edits safe? Disclose more? I am being sincere.Highflyingkitty (talk) 16:08, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

Ok I have read it, thank you. I will enlist others. Highflyingkitty (talk) 16:14, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

While Wikipedia assumes good faith, especially for new users, recruiting new editors to influence decisions on Wikipedia is prohibited.


Hi Malcolm. We are a group of community members in the Bronx, Queens, and Brooklyn working together to improve Wikipedia narratives about POC and stories told about our communities. I helped put our efforts together but we have no official group name. We were inspired by similar work being done by other editathonsHighflyingkitty (talk) 16:08, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

I hate to bring this back up again but I just got sent an email about this from someone claiming to be a journalist. I am posting it here in its entire glory:

I'm a journalist with Bronx Justice News working on a story about an incident on Wikipedia this week in which several Bronx residents and other New Yorkers, all people of color, were allegedly banned from editing the site, referred to as a mob, talked down to in racially insensitive terms, and had many of their edits to articles concerning people of color, and issues relevant to communities of color, deleted. We were sent screen shots by one of these editors, a correction officer here in the Bronx, which shows the before and after versions of several articles on issues like lynching, white privilege, and historic Black figures, which these editors attempted to contribute to. It's also my understanding that the Wikipedia page of one of our staff reporters, Kevin Deutsch, was involved in this incident. And another reporter of ours, Sasha Gonzales, was also banned, apparently because she was working off the same wifi or IP address as one of the comunity editors when she made a comment on Wikipedia earlier in the week.

We have also been sent several screen shots showing exchanges between a Wikipedia administrator named Jorm (identified on his talk page as Mr. Brandon Harris), and one of the banned editors of color. According to the editors we spoke with, they were participating in a loosely organized "edit-a-thon" on Wikipedia focusing on articles involving people and issues pertinent to their communities, and had openly disclosed this fact on their talk pages, as well as to administrators. From what I can gather, it appears their involvement in a preexisting dispute about Mr. Deutsch's Wikipedia article immediately preceeded their being banned.

I'm reaching out today to ask whether the foundation, or Mr. Harris, or both, would like to respond to the allegations being made by several of these editors, who are claiming racial bias and racist treatment by Wikipedia adminsitrators and editors, including Mr. Harris. One particular screen shot shows a female editor, who will be included in our story, asking for an administrator of color to mediate the dispute; the last communication she apparently made before she was banned. Could you respond to that allegation, and perhaps provide a reason why an editor of color was not brought on to help these editors navigate the situation? We would greatly appreciate any comments you wish to provide in response to these allegations, as we wish aim to fully capture both sides of this story.

We are also requesting a breakdown of how many white employees work at the Wikipedia Foundation, versus employees of color; what the foundation is doing to avoid incidents like the one described above; whether administrators undergo any special racial sensitivity training (or will as a result of this incident), and any other applicable facts you think worth including about these issues or related ones.

Our deadline for the article on these events is Friday at 5 p.m. EST. Thank you.

Eric Klein Editor Bronx Justice News @bxjusticenews Office: 718-473-9731

This was also cc'd to press at wikimedia dot org. Fun times!--Jorm (talk) 23:16, 5 August 2020 (UTC)

Armantkb reverts my edits without explanation and I've both encouraged them to use the talkpage in the edit-summary and on their talkpage. --Semsûrî (talk) 09:12, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

After making (sourced to the official Boxing Union of Ireland website, the is above the table) which removed an by HuntGroup, the user took exception to my correct and sourced edit and engaged in a brief edit war (seen and ), of which their reasoning for restoring incorrect, unsourced information was "...If you are going to remove champions at least have the good grace to add to them to the list of former champions" (when they could have done that themselves instead of needlessly reverting lol). They echoed their illogical point with a borderline PA on my talk page (), I replied informing them that that is no reason to revert incorrect, unsourced information back in (), and left an edit war template on their talk page (), which appeared to have the desired effect as they stopped the needless reverting. Their response was and to drop me a retaliatory template on my talk page (of which I removed). The user then followed me to a CfD discussion to cast a seemingly retaliatory vote (), followed by what I consider another PA on my talk page (), disrespect often manifests responses in kind, I replied and told them to no longer post on my talk page (). End of story? Nope. Following another person attack on the talk page I asked them not to post on () they continued to stalk my edits to add a retaliatory comment at an article talk page that I'm guessing they've never previously edited before, just for shits and giggles (). I let them know in no uncertain terms that their behaviour isn't acceptable () to which they responded with another personal attack () and some more stalky behaviour; , which I will revert as its blatantly retaliatory, and pointless comment which again, is a PA. I'm guessing their antics up to this point don't warrant a block, but at the very least this user needs a few stern words regarding their disruptive, and to be quite frank, just outright weird editing behaviour. – 2.O.Boxing 11:37, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

First diff – You were correct, I forgot about the BUI Celtic title, which is why I haven't reverted your revert.

Again of which the removal is covered by WP:RPA. I'm not sure if RPA is an exemption from 3RR so I'll refrain from another immediate revert, for now. – 2.O.Boxing 14:25, 6 August 2020 (UTC)

(Non-administrator comment) I haven't dived into this deep at all and did not review any of Square's work so I have no opinion about Squared's editing. I'm just dropping in because I noticed HuntGroup said the other ed (bold added) In theory at least, it isn't supposed to matter how wrong the other editor may have been, we each stand on our own choices. Whether your characterization of the other ed is right or not, we can assume you believed it to be true and say you mirrored it..... that sure sounds to me like a confession you were engaged in WP:BULLYING yourself NewsAndEventsGuy (talk) 15:03, 6 August 2020 (UTC)

has been editing in a bullying manner and is unwilling to edit in a collaborative manner. This is what drew my attention to his editing. I was merely mirroring his editing style...

Any diffs for this claim? Or is it yet again, another unfounded aspersion? You have been to four "pages" that "I'm on", one is my talk page, two are article talk pages and the other is a CfD discussions (all of which you have followed me to), and the only person crying about bullying, is, you, on all of them lol Give your head a wobble would ya. – 2.O.Boxing 15:21, 6 August 2020 (UTC)

Every page I have been to that you are on I have seen editors accuse you of aggression, bullying and punching down.

I am referring to User:HelpfulCaribbeanPrivateer (who registered the account yesterday) and User:The Oriental Despot (who registered in February). The account's user pages are blank.

Edits made by these two accounts almost entirely include YouTube videos (including one from the deprecated RT) which seem to be intended as a promotion of the article subject rather than as an attempt to develop the article. One reliable source (The Guardian) has been removed twice as "fringe"; it mentions Susli's on air interview with a Holocaust denier. Philip Cross (talk) 16:18, 4 August 2020 (UTC)

(Have modified earlier headings to this section.) These two editors are now making minor edits, some useful and acceptable, some purely disruptive and POV, to articles which I have heavily worked on the past and mention on my user page. As I am not able to edit many of these articles because of a BLP topic ban on post-1978 British politics, these edits seem like a deliberate taunt, attempt at harassment and a personal attack. I have not added any of the appropriate templates to the user talk pages, because it is clear these two accounts ignore any warnings, quite apart from being directly involved myself.

Yesterday, before the tragedy in Beirut, the @partisangirl account on Twitter was re/tweeting attacks on me or against Wikipedia, though most of those from yesterday have been deleted. Philip Cross (talk) 12:56, 5 August 2020 (UTC)

User:The Oriental Despot is now banned from editing the Maram Susli article. Yet this editor is still continuing to edit the article:

Sapah3 and MistyfelSR appear to be involved in some sort of argument re edit warring. Can an uninvolved admin take a look and investigate? They have resorted to using AIV and AN3 as a warring platform, after one accused the other of being a sock of an IP. Thanks. Nightfury 08:13, 5 August 2020 (UTC)

They are a new account and appear to be the same person as (an IP address that was blocked last week for harassing me on multiple occasions e.g. , ).
MistyfelSR, without commenting on the sock allegations, can I ask you to explain your thinking when you made the two reverts linked in the previous post?
Hi, for the first revert, though they have added the missing 'have', there was also a discreet change from 'East' to 'Southeast' which wasn't mentioned in the edit summary. That's more than just a grammatical error. Throughout the article, there are a lot of mentions of Thailand being very much influenced by East Asian culture in many ways and it was a constructive addition made by another user a while back based on what I've seen in the revision history.

We have Special:Contributions/115.134.228.186 and Special:Contributions/115.132.140.3 both on Telekom Malaysia. I don't see how this can be stopped but if anyone does, great. Doug Weller talk 12:21, 5 August 2020 (UTC)

In late July, I had a content dispute with Grufo at Islam and blasphemy. During that dispute the user , employed a negative tone, accused those disgreeing of and also accusing me of sockpuppetry (""). Grufo insisted on interpreting the Qur'an for their self to insert "The Quran prescribes either prison or mutilation or death for those guilty of blasphemy". Grufo defended this by insisting things like "". Ultimately, the user was convinced by three others (including Eperoton) that interpreting the Qur'an themselves was WP:OR and the dispute mainly ended, or so I thought.

Since then Grufo has gone around undoing my edits at 11 different articles (Grufo's contribs), articles that Grufo seems to have never edited before. This includes restoring unreliable sources,,,,,. It also includes making reverts from past content disputes at Rape in Islamic law without engaging in the discussion about that content (Grufo's on the talk page doesn't come close to discussing the ). Grufo's duplicated some content in the lead.

Grufo's editing is very tenditious, taking a sharply anti-Muslim tone. The user insists on using Raymond Ibrahim, Nonie Darwish, and The Legacy of Jihad as reliable sources. Others agree with me that Raymond Ibrahim . Grufo admitted that Darwish was "" but insisted such sources were reliable and "Khomeini, in his subsequent writings, also approved of adults satisfying their sexual lusts with children provided such activities stopped short of any penetration". Grufo repeatedly accuses me and others of trying to "" and "" content.VR talk 14:18, 5 August 2020 (UTC)

On the contrary, among other things I have tried to avoid that a subjective minority interpretation of the Quran be used as representative of the article, and I have tried to rely as much as possible only on the secondary sources that are supported by tertiary sources.
“Ultimately, the user was convinced by three others (including Eperoton) that interpreting the Qur'an themselves was WP:OR”
I think you lived in a parallel discussion. I did not interpret the Quran (nor I intend to). I did the exact opposite.
“Since then Grufo has gone around undoing my edits at 11 different articles”“Grufo's editing is very tenditious, taking a sharply anti-Muslim tone”
How can that be? Either I reverted your edits or I added anti-Muslim content. Please do explain it or give an example.
“Grufo admitted that Darwish was "anti-Islamic" but insisted such sources were reliable”
I insisted (and I still do) that being critical of Islam or religion in general has nothing to do with being reliable or not as a source as you seem to imply – no more and no less than being Islamic or not caring at all about Islam does. On the other hand, since the only sources you have removed are the openly anti-Islamic ones, I must deduce that you consider being anti-Islamic as a valid motivation for being labeled as unreliable source.
“The user insists on using Raymond Ibrahim, Nonie Darwish, and The Legacy of Jihad as reliable sources”
I only restored the sources that have been removed without a valid motivation by you.
“Grufo repeatedly accuses me and others of trying to "hide" and "silence" content”
It is literally what you have been trying to do so far, or at least as far as I could check. It looks like you feel invested of some sort of mission on Wikipedia. But whatever mission you feel you have, it does not matter as long as your edits are acceptable and not destructive.

The article Differential geometry of surfaces (DGS) is one that I helped prepares twelve years ago in February 2008. For some time I have known that DGS has not been in am imperfect state. While writing the article, I added further content which became a separate article Riemannian connection on a surface (geared to graduate students). The original paper has many imperfections largely because, like other parts of wikipedia, it still remains unwritten. There were many gaps in the article, particular at the beginning and the lede, because it had broken off as a fork. However I decided recently to make the long overdue improvements to the article, knowing bits that were glaringly missing: first to symmetry of second derivatives and then to inverse function theorem. I just summarised very briefly a page or two out of Lars Hörmander and Henri Cartan (world experts).

Then User:D.Lazard decided he did not like some of the new introductory material which he blanked five times. I believe that this kind of blanking is extremely uncommon on wikipedia. D.Lazard did not seem to have give any coherent explanation of his blanking. He wikilwawyered and criticized the title "Differential geometry of surface."

D.Lazard has been told that the brief preparatory section is needed for the new section "Regular surfaces in Euclidean space". At the moment the paragraph of requisites is just a brief summary without proofs. The new content on "regular surface" is in the course of being written. The sources are the lecture noteds of Nigel Hitchin and Eugenio Calabi, as well as text boos by Pelham Wilson, Andrew Pressley, Manfredo do Carmo, Barrett O'Neill and Dirk Struik. D.Lazard's repeated blanking is unhelpful. In addition he has not made any attempt to discuss the proposed new material, which seems to me straightorward. He has accused me of WP:OWN, but he knows that there are certain prerequistes are needed for telling the story of Gauss and his remarkable discoveries. Most of contributions in mathematics have been to harmonic analysis, symmetric spaces, representation theory, etc. Differential geometry of surfaces is an undergraduate article: in the UK that is the case (e.g. in Oxford and Cambridge) and also for honors undergraduates in the US. D..Lazard's blanking is incredible. He has no authority to prevent standard content being created. As far as I am aware, he does not produce any such content himself. Other blanking by Russ Woodruffe has also happened (using WP:BRD as a pretext).

I have created an even shorter summary, now placed only in the "Regular surface" section. D.Lazard's blanking has been disruptive. It seems to be a combination of WP:POINT and WP:NOTHERE. Very little to do with content creation, which requires calm and careful thought. Mathsci (talk) 15:31, 5 August 2020 (UTC)

About the accusation of WP:OWN, it suffices to read above mathsci's post to be convinced that it is a problem for mathsci.
Article was moved from draftspace to mainspace after improving, no attempt to game the system was made. RickinBaltimore (talk) 20:11, 5 August 2020 (UTC)

Gouri Kishan - This subject article was moved to draft with consensus over here Wikipedia:Articles_for_deletion/Gouri_Kishan

Now a user named The Anandu (talk · contribs) recreated the page with a variation of the name and created a redirect. I suggest this kind of behavior to game the system should be taken seriously. - The9Man (Talk) 15:50, 5 August 2020 (UTC)

Of course those are not active spammers, but most of their links are still there so maybe some cleanup is required in the articles (that i’d rather not do myself). I believe each one of the links either violates copyright or can be effectively redirected to archive.org, yet they are dead anyway.

and whoever added links to the same websites back then. — 188.123.231.32 (talk) 18:34, 5 August 2020 (UTC)

This user seems to be creating articles without regard for notability, especially television episodes. The articles that were AfD'd or boldly redirected are listed in the collapsible. Today, they also restored an article that was boldly redirected due to lack of notability twice. (diff, diff)

EDIT: Also List of What Would You Do? episodes for What Would You Do? (AfD). This AfD closed as Keep. 09:36, 6 August 2020 (UTC)

Recreating articles () after consensus from prior AFD is to delete. Creating articles that fail WP:EPISODE guidelines. Creating redirects that do not meet WP:EPISODE (, , , , , , , , ). Creating other extraneous redirects (, ). On : —————. These actions show signs the user is not yet ready to contribute. AldezD (talk) 14:56, 8 August 2020 (UTC)

Been warned multiple times. This IP appears to be only used for adding incorrect information or removing correct information. -- Guherto (talk) 10:09, 6 August 2020 (UTC)

92.19.171.132 (talk · contribs) is adding misinformation about decades faster than the 3 revert rule would allow me to correct. The editor is claiming, , the 1990s are generally considered to comprise 1991 to and including 2000. Editors familiar with past calendar-related issues may feel the location of the editor, southwest England, is familiar. Jc3s5h (talk) 12:41, 6 August 2020 (UTC)

Accusations of off-wiki harassment (with links), an offwiki campaign to add antisemitic material, etc at Talk:Israel

To be precise, at . I'm not going to have a chance to deal with it. Doug Weller talk 13:07, 6 August 2020 (UTC)

I left an "only warning" note on User talk:TheEpicGhosty for the attempted outing. I suppressed the material. This is truly bringing out the cream of the crop, with usernames to boot. What kind of person sticks "88" in their username? I haven't had coffee yet so I don't want to start dropping blocks, and I can't see any evidence yet of an off-wiki campaign or whatever. (The material in the lead needs to be discussed. RegentsPark, I saw your revert in the lead in Saudi-Arabia; that's relevant here as well.) Drmies (talk) 13:33, 6 August 2020 (UTC)

There's a strange pattern of edits by User:4.78.42.18 to the article on Jan M. Ziolkowski that also appear to be spamming his published work in other articles. Should they be investigated? Sweetpool50 (talk) 15:50, 6 August 2020 (UTC)

IP has been blocked for 3 months, no more action needed. Ghinga7 (talk) 22:10, 6 August 2020 (UTC)

This IP has been involved in attacking multiple editors, spanning almost a year. They [ and calling another editor a "stalker" for giving them warnings for disruptive editing. In addition, they called me a on my talk page. The editor also has been warned for personal attacks in the past however they have continued with attacks on both and . -- LuK3 (Talk) 16:19, 6 August 2020 (UTC)

Hagia Sophia  has been under attack from faceless vandals since its edit-protection wore off recently. I propose that swift action to protect the page would prevent further casual disruption. The issue I have already reported at the edit-warring noticeboard and at the page protection request list. If the page can be protected (and the present vandal blocked) then peace and stability can be restored. GPinkerton (talk) 18:09, 6 August 2020 (UTC)

The is nonstop, the editors are spending a lot of time trying to clean up the damage.

Would appreciate any assistance with this.JlACEer (talk) 19:00, 6 August 2020 (UTC)

Editor is being hostile towards edits they don't like and trying to give a hard time

en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:LGBT_rights_in_the_United_Arab_Emirates&action=history @Martinevans123: is blocking edits done that add additional non-government sanctions for homosexuality in the UAE. The consensus among the editors who shared their opinion is that it can be added as info underneath not inside the punishment box itself. However, this user seems to disagree and block all edits adding this information, giving an excuse each time why he won't add it. The consensus has also agreed it can be added with the for mentioned condition that it is added underneath. Please talk reason into him and get him to stop his canvassing and add the agreed sources. Thanks. 91.197.129.74 (talk)

This is part of an off-wiki campaign to try to harass and see if they can get him blocked. Admins please block these accounts as meatpuppets with DENY in mind.

The account Semsûrî has repeatedly abused their position over the years by targeting and heavily editing multiple Assyrian pages to their liking, due to racial motives. There have been attempts to reach out, for them to leave the Assyrian pages alone, however they have continuously ignored our pleas and conversations.

They have pettily removed information that is largely acknowledged, frequently stating that "there is no source" as their excuse. However in the past they still have removed information (especially information that details Kurdish history's onslaught on Assyrians), despite accompanied by sources, because once again, they are driven by racial motivation. They also have not attempted to add sources themselves despite their meddling.

This clearly breaches WP:harassment and undermines the Assyrian community. They have no connection to the community nor are they administration but they still go out of their way to harass the community - Les.témoin (talk) 12:55, 7 August (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Les.témoin (talkcontribs)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

User:Helper201 has been repeatedly reverting edits by a number of editors to their preferred version over a period of time. A slow motion edit war?

Over at Chris Heaton-Harris is arguing for the inclusion of this [] based upon on combination of wp:or and WP:SYNTHESIS. Over at WP:NPOVN they really are bludgeoning the discussion. For me the final straw was (in response to me arguing its it a violation of wP:undue to include this to post this [], which include links to articles in RS that do not even mention Heaton-Harris.

To me its clear they are trying to fight (over one speech an MP has made) the good fight and are wp:nothere.Slatersteven (talk) 13:19, 7 August 2020 (UTC)

Might I suggest we close this and StanTwoCents is offed mentoring?Slatersteven (talk) 09:18, 8 August 2020 (UTC)

User:Detyu15 has been trying to edit the estimates of Copts or Christians in Egypt to make it seem higher, and cherrypicking sources. The exact number or percentage isn't known, and estimates vary widely between 5% (or 5 million) to 20% of Egypt's population. He has been trying to ignore the lower estimates. The article should reflect that wide variation in estimates. From the history of these articles, it seems this issue has been going on for a long time. Related articles are Copts, Copts in Egypt, Christianity in Egypt and Coptic Orthodox Church of Alexandria. MohamedTalk 14:55, 7 August 2020 (UTC)

User:Fate Grand Order Babylonia has been persistently adding citations from a non-reliable anime blog to articles, as can be in their contribution history: -- almost every one of their edits has linked to this blog. I reverted their edits at four articles (Kakushigoto: My Dad's Secret Ambition, Toilet-Bound Hanako-kun, Pokemon, Pandora Hearts) and they later reverted me on all four articles with this summary: , They also left this message on my talk: .

I found the source reliable for I cross checked the facts given in the source, after proper cross check , I cited the source.

Since this summary indicates a lack of knowledge of WP:RS, I left this message on the user's talk page informing them on WP policy and reverted them again: . Several hours later, they reverted me with no edit summary at the same four articles, and I reverted them again and left this second, more detailed warning on their talk: .

Now, the user seems to be operating this sockpuppet: User:Dark Knight Ingrid, which has added back the blog citation while trying to hide it -- they filled in the "author" and "website" fields in the template to disguise it as Anime News Network (a reliable source per WP:A&M/ORS), but still linked to the blog in the "url" field. They also wrote a phony edit summary, so this was not a mistake: Added Citation from Anime News Network. — Goszei (talk) 02:22, 8 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello. So an admin has blocked me for two years since I was using multiple IP addresses. First of all, as of late, I have not used a VPN. And secondly, the reason I appear under different IP addresses is simple. I’m an out of state student at LVC, a private school near Hershey Pennsylvania, and started editing Wikipedia pages on my free time at my high school and home for fun. So because of that, I would appear under three different IP addresses, one for home, one for my high school, and one for my college (LVC). If you could please review my block, that would be great. :) Thomasgilbertie (talk) 04:07, 8 August 2020 (UTC)

User: Yogaguruaniljain is not here to contribute to the encyclopedia and is only here to promote themselves, repeatedly submitting a draft, and move-warring about its title. Request a block. Robert McClenon (talk) 06:29, 8 August 2020 (UTC)

Editor under IP 96.43.244.95 has previously been warned a lot for vandalising, but is back today and has already vandalised multiple articles, to all adding the same unreferenced conspiracy theory. Please consider a ban. StanTwoCents (talk) 13:28, 8 August 2020 (UTC)